Monday, 27 September 2010

Monday Mormon - Jesus God the Son, or the Son of God?

Its Monday Mormon again, at least it is where I am, and I am sure it will have been, or indeed soon will be, where you are. Aren’t time zones fascinating? We continue to ask some of the 21 questions, indeed this time we deal with three on the same subject – Jesus. The Mormon Church has responded to all three with the same, rather brusque and less than candid answer so lets see if we can squeeze some truth from this exercise. As before, we will look at the questions (Q) and answers (A) with comments (C) and quotes (Qu.)

Q: Does the Mormon Church believe that Jesus Christ is the son of God?

A: Mormons believe Jesus Christ is literally the Son of God, the Savior and Redeemer, who died for the sins of humankind and rose from the dead on the third day with an immortal body. God, the Father, also has an immortal body.

Q: Does the Church believe in the divinity of Jesus?

A: Mormons believe Jesus Christ is literally the Son of God, the Savior and Redeemer, who died for the sins of humankind and rose from the dead on the third day with an immortal body. God, the Father, also has an immortal body.

Q: Does the Church believe that God is a physical being?

A: Mormons believe Jesus Christ is literally the Son of God, the Savior and Redeemer, who died for the sins of humankind and rose from the dead on the third day with an immortal body. God, the Father, also has an immortal body.

Qu: “God Himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens...If the veil were rent today...if you were to see him today, you would see him like a man in form ” (Joseph Smith, Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 345)

C: The god of Mormonism has a body and, like the Wizard of Oz, he only appears omnipotent. Pull back the veil and you see a man, indeed a huckster passing himself off as something he is not.

Mormons use the phrase “literally the Son of God” as though it is a classic orthodox Christian tenet but by this deceptively simple phrase they are conveying their belief that an “exalted man” with a physical body had intercourse with an exalted woman and, from that union, came the “literal Son of God”.

While the Bible teaches and Christians believe that Jesus is “literally God the Son”, the eternal God, Mormons believe he is “literally the Son of God”, the offspring of a man they worship as God and a woman they regard as their goddess mother. Indeed, neither is he the “only Begotten” but the first of countless millions conceived and born in the same way, you among them. The “Only Begotten” part only applies in Mormon thinking to Jesus “in the flesh”, i.e born of Mary, and even that is not what you might expect, but more on that later.

To answer the questions according to Mormon orthodoxy then:

Q: Does the Mormon Church believe that Jesus Christ is the son of God?

The Mormon Church believes that Jesus is the offspring of God but not God the Son as Christians understand him

Q: Does the Church believe in the divinity of Jesus?

The Mormon Church believes that Jesus is a god in a pantheon which faithful Mormons expect to join

Q: Does the Church believe that God is a physical being?

Yes. The Mormon god is an exalted, glorified man

6 comments:

  1. For those who read Mike's responses and are unfamiliar with what the LDS church believes, you should know that he is no expert and frequently adds his opinion, which is not the opinion of the church or its members. Also, if any of us sound defensive, it's because we are. Our God is important to us and what he commands is as well.

    As a good example, the LDS believe that God the Father IS omnipotent, not just appears.
    Yes we believe the Jesus is God's literal son. You will not find a quote from a prophet saying the we believe God had intercourse with Mary. The implication here is erroneous.

    Yes we believe that God was once a man, now is a God with still a body, just like Jesus.
    References:

    Gen 1:27, 5:1, 9:6. Man was made God's image.
    2 Cor 2 4:4 Christ, who is the image of God.

    Image, as used by the Greeks and Hebrew's denotes a physical structure. So as evidenced by these verses (and many others) the physical structure of GOD is like CHrist's, an immortal being with a physical body.


    "The Mormon Church believes that Jesus is the offspring of God but not God the Son as Christians understand him"

    If they believe in anything other than this, they are wrong, as the Bible assures the right way.

    And yes, we believed that we can become God's and will show that this is Biblical, but Mike, try to stay on topic.

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  2. Erik, Thanks for confirming what I have written. That Mormons believe God is an exalted man with a physical body and that Mormons expect to become gods themselves. How a man "becomes" omnipotent is a thorny issue. Omnipotent, omnipresence, omniscience are all the absolute qualities of God. You either have them or you don't. You don't grow in them as though you are a little bit omniscient today and a bit more tomorrow. I wonder if you have thought this through.

    As to there being no quote from any Mormon prophet saying God had sex with mary, will Bruce R McConkie and Brigham Young do for you?

    "The Only Begotten of the Father. (Moses 5:9). These name titles all signify that our Lord is the only Son of the Father in the flesh. Each of the words is to be understood literally. Only means only; Begotten means begotten; and Son means son. Christ was begotten by an Immortal Father in the same way that mortal men are begotten by mortal fathers." (Bruce R McConkie, Mormon Doctrine)

    "When the time came that his First-born, the Savior, should come into the world and take a tabernacle, the Father came himself and favored that Spirit with a tabernacle instead of letting any other man do it. The Savior was begotten by the Father and his Spirit, by the same Being who is the Father of our spirits, and that is all the organic difference between Jesus Christ and you and me." (Brigham Young, JOD)

    What were you saying about my not knowing what I was talking about?

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  3. Like I said, never have they said that they had sexual intercourse. Jesus received physical qualities from the Father. Physical qualities require DNA to build the proteins, etc. How the Father's DNA combined with Mary's is still not specified. Even if it is true, which does not offend me, how then was Jesus created in the flesh. How does "Christianity" explain it?

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  4. Erik, You have warned others against my questionable expertise and yet, at every turn, confirmed everything I have so far claimed, even to agreeing that God might indeed have had sex with his daughter Mary in order that she should give birth to her own brother Jesus. Thank you.

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  5. Show me how this is in any way non-biblical, blesphemous or wrong. How else was Christ's mortal body made? How does "Christianity" explain it. There is only one way that we know of for a baby to happen. Mary was incapable of forming a body on her own. And we know that God the Ffather has a body. Need references:


    Luke 24: 39 for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

    John 14: 9 he that hath seen me hath seen the Father.

    Acts 7: 56 the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.

    Rom. 8: 29 predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son.

    2 Cor. 4: 4 Christ, who is the image of God.

    Philip. 2: 6 who, being in the form of God.

    Philip. 3: 21 our vile body . . . fashioned like unto his glorious body.

    Col. 1: 15 Who is the image of the invisible God.

    Heb. 1: 3 the express image of his person.

    James 3: 9 men which are made after the similitude of God.

    1 Jn. 3: 2 when he shall appear, we shall be like him.


    Furthermore, as far as being omnipotent and omniscious, we know that God and Jesus Christ are now. That is all that matters. Show me where it says that God did not have a mortal experience like we are going through right now.
    Citation of scripture should accompany your rebuttal.

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  6. Erik, Why are you so cross? I know what Mormonism teaches but you have posted a comment questioning my knowledge and understanding even though your every comment confirms what I have said. I moderate every comment so your comment didn't get put up automatically. I chose to grant you the opportunity to express your views. You might be thankful.

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